Weird behaviour with "Minimum Activation"?

[homerojleal]

My TPI settings are as follows:

I'm using version 9.3.0 and only setting I have "outside the "UI" and in the configuration.yml is as follows:

versatile_thermostat:
max_on_percent: 0.7

Looking at the graphs...I believe the "Minimum Activation" is not working as expected.
Even though I have the value = 1600s, it seems to turn off the switch even before reach 1600s of on_percent/time.
And I also verify that temperature does not rise above upper threshold (20.8 set point + 0.3 high-TPI threshold).

Is there something I'm might be miss understanding in regards to the expected behaviour?
Is there an open-known issue related to this "possible problem"?

[jmcollin78]

Hello,

Can you give me your custom attributes of the the VTherm ? (Dev Tools / State).

[homerojleal]

hvac_modes:
  - heat
  - cool
  - "off"
min_temp: 18
max_temp: 26
target_temp_step: 0.1
preset_modes:
  - none
  - frost
  - eco
  - comfort
  - boost
current_temperature: 22
temperature: 20.8
hvac_action: idle
preset_mode: comfort
hvac_mode: heat
ema_temp: 22.05
is_ready: true
specific_states:
  is_initialized: true
  is_on: true
  last_central_mode: Heat only
  last_update_datetime: "2026-03-30T22:00:38.240019+01:00"
  ext_current_temperature: 14.6999998092651
  last_temperature_datetime: "2026-03-30T21:53:50.944176+01:00"
  last_ext_temperature_datetime: "2026-03-30T22:00:38.215176+01:00"
  should_device_be_active: false
  is_device_active: false
  device_actives: []
  nb_device_actives: 0
  ema_temp: 22.05
  temperature_slope: -0.58
  hvac_off_reason: null
  total_energy: 29.57
  last_change_time_from_vtherm: "2026-03-30T21:56:12.964729+01:00"
  is_sleeping: false
  is_locked: true
  is_recalculate_scheduled: false
  not_initialized_entities: []
  messages: []
  auto_tpi_state: "off"
  auto_tpi_continuous_kext: "off"
  auto_tpi_learning: {}
configuration:
  ac_mode: true
  type: over_switch
  is_controlled_by_central_mode: true
  target_temperature_step: 0.1
  timezone: Europe/Lisbon
  temperature_unit: °C
  is_used_by_central_boiler: false
  max_on_percent: 0.7
  have_valve_regulation: false
  cycle_min: 90
  minimal_activation_delay_sec: 1600
  minimal_deactivation_delay_sec: 600
preset_temperatures:
  frost_temp: 18
  eco_temp: 20.3
  boost_temp: 21.8
  comfort_temp: 20.8
  frost_away_temp: 0
  eco_away_temp: 0
  boost_away_temp: 0
  comfort_away_temp: 0
current_state:
  hvac_mode: heat
  target_temperature: 20.8
  preset: comfort
requested_state:
  hvac_mode: heat
  target_temperature: 20.8
  preset: comfort
is_presence_configured: false
is_power_configured: false
power_manager:
  device_power: 0
  mean_cycle_power: null
is_motion_configured: false
is_window_configured: false
is_window_auto_configured: false
is_safety_configured: true
safety_manager:
  safety_state: "off"
  safety_delay_min: 60
  safety_min_on_percent: 0.5
  safety_default_on_percent: 0.28
is_lock_configured: true
lock_manager:
  is_locked: true
  lock_users: true
  lock_automations: true
  lock_code: false
  auto_relock_sec: 30
timed_preset_manager:
  is_active: false
  preset: null
  original_preset: null
  end_time: null
  remaining_time_min: 0
is_heating_failure_detection_configured: false
is_repair_incorrect_state_configured: false
is_over_switch: true
on_percent: 0
power_percent: 0
vtherm_over_switch:
  is_inversed: false
  keep_alive_sec: 0
  underlying_entities:
    - switch.panasonic_heat_pump_gpio_relay_one
  on_percent: 0
  power_percent: 0
  on_time_sec: 0
  off_time_sec: 5400
  function: tpi
  vswitch_on_commands: []
  vswitch_off_commands: []
  tpi_coef_int: 0.75
  tpi_coef_ext: 0.01
  tpi_threshold_low: 0.1
  tpi_threshold_high: 0.3
  minimal_activation_delay: 1600
  minimal_deactivation_delay: 600
friendly_name: Versatile Thermostat P0
supported_features: 401

[homerojleal]

This morning the "behaviour" was even worst (with latest version installed).
I don't remember this happening before < 9.x.x version and the only thing I changed was to test the "max_on_percent: 0.7" behaviour.

[jmcollin78]

Hello, you have combine too much parameter:

• high_tpi_threshold, low_tpi_threshold, max_on_percent, min and max activation delay

Nobody is able to predict how the algorithm with behave then.

I suggest to remove high_tpi_threshold, low_tpi_threshold and max_on_percent.

See if the behvior is correct.
See with min and max activation delay if the behavior is correct.

90 min cycle is very, very, very long cycle and then you reduce the cycle with some very high minimal_activation_delay. A good value is more 5 min (or 15 if you have a big inertia).

What do you want to achieve ?

[homerojleal]

Ok I will remove/disable these configs - "high_tpi_threshold, low_tpi_threshold and max_on_percent", and see how it behaves (min and max activation delay).

Yeah its quite a specific setup... :)

• Heating system is a heat pump (air-water) with a couple of smart vented convectors (water 4xºC) - 25-30 minute on_active heat time is the minimum to get water up to 4xºC, and raise of internal temperature of about 0.2-0.4ºC, and not have frequent on/off heat pump switching
• Passive House where the heat loss is very low (not so cold external temp of 4-8 ºC) - I only loose about 1ºC in 24 hours without any heating system, meaning usually only need about 20-40 minute of on_active heating every 90 min
  Note: I've discovered this "setup-values" that provide quite some temperature stability using simple standalone Honeywell thermostats in the last 2 years - Now I was just looking into a smarter alternative (remote) and with a bit more faster of reaction-precision (+-0.2/0.4 ºC) - the old-previous thermostats sometimes would react very slowly (on and off) and with poorer precision (+-0.5-0.8ºC)

[homerojleal]

After removing the "high_tpi_threshold, low_tpi_threshold and max_on_percent" configurations, the "weird behaviour" with "min and max activation delay" features-functionality remains.

Even though the min activation delay = 1600 seconds the actual on_time /on_percent was about 7xx seconds.

Anything I can do to debug this further?

hvac_modes:
  - heat
  - cool
  - "off"
min_temp: 18
max_temp: 26
target_temp_step: 0.1
preset_modes:
  - none
  - frost
  - eco
  - comfort
  - boost
current_temperature: 22
temperature: 20.8
hvac_action: idle
preset_mode: comfort
hvac_mode: heat
ema_temp: 21.99
is_ready: true
specific_states:
  is_initialized: true
  is_on: true
  last_central_mode: Heat only
  last_update_datetime: "2026-04-02T22:23:50.768345+01:00"
  ext_current_temperature: 14.5
  last_temperature_datetime: "2026-04-02T22:03:59.347900+01:00"
  last_ext_temperature_datetime: "2026-04-02T22:23:50.750707+01:00"
  should_device_be_active: false
  is_device_active: false
  device_actives: []
  nb_device_actives: 0
  ema_temp: 21.99
  temperature_slope: -0.04
  hvac_off_reason: null
  total_energy: 29.57
  last_change_time_from_vtherm: "2026-03-31T23:46:29.464060+01:00"
  is_sleeping: false
  is_locked: true
  is_recalculate_scheduled: false
  not_initialized_entities: []
  messages: []
  auto_tpi_state: "off"
  auto_tpi_continuous_kext: "off"
  auto_tpi_learning: {}
configuration:
  ac_mode: true
  type: over_switch
  is_controlled_by_central_mode: true
  target_temperature_step: 0.1
  timezone: Europe/Lisbon
  temperature_unit: °C
  is_used_by_central_boiler: false
  max_on_percent: null
  have_valve_regulation: false
  cycle_min: 90
  minimal_activation_delay_sec: 1600
  minimal_deactivation_delay_sec: 600
preset_temperatures:
  frost_temp: 18
  eco_temp: 20.3
  boost_temp: 21.8
  comfort_temp: 20.8
  frost_away_temp: 0
  eco_away_temp: 0
  boost_away_temp: 0
  comfort_away_temp: 0
current_state:
  hvac_mode: heat
  target_temperature: 20.8
  preset: comfort
requested_state:
  hvac_mode: heat
  target_temperature: 20.8
  preset: comfort
is_presence_configured: false
is_power_configured: false
power_manager:
  device_power: 0
  mean_cycle_power: null
is_motion_configured: false
is_window_configured: false
is_window_auto_configured: false
is_safety_configured: true
safety_manager:
  safety_state: "off"
  safety_delay_min: 60
  safety_min_on_percent: 0.5
  safety_default_on_percent: 0.28
is_lock_configured: true
lock_manager:
  is_locked: true
  lock_users: true
  lock_automations: true
  lock_code: false
  auto_relock_sec: 30
timed_preset_manager:
  is_active: false
  preset: null
  original_preset: null
  end_time: null
  remaining_time_min: 0
is_heating_failure_detection_configured: false
is_repair_incorrect_state_configured: false
is_over_switch: true
on_percent: 0
power_percent: 0
vtherm_over_switch:
  is_inversed: false
  keep_alive_sec: 0
  underlying_entities:
    - switch.panasonic_heat_pump_gpio_relay_one
  on_percent: 0
  power_percent: 0
  on_time_sec: 0
  off_time_sec: 5400
  function: tpi
  vswitch_on_commands: []
  vswitch_off_commands: []
  tpi_coef_int: 0.75
  tpi_coef_ext: 0.01
  tpi_threshold_low: 0
  tpi_threshold_high: 0
  minimal_activation_delay: 1600
  minimal_deactivation_delay: 600
friendly_name: Versatile Thermostat P0
supported_features: 401

[jmcollin78]

Hello,

I transform this discussion into an issue because it seems there is an issue. Thank you for the report.