minimap in the corner & chance to hit + damage dealt vanilla vs devX

[JohnnyR8]

thanks guys for this phenomenal mod/port... really like going back to old days :-)

i have 2 question:

on the main devilutionX page on the picture is a minimap in the right corner.. how can i get this in win build?
https://github.com/diasurgical/devilutionX

this minimap is also seeable in the mac build:
#6936

the other question has to do with chance to hit & dealt damage:

i know that devX creators changed the displayed cth:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Diablo1/comments/zcxuwb/did_devilutionx_up_the_base_hit_chance/?rdt=60706

in vanilla GOG - Diablo 1.09 the starting rogue has armorclass: 6 and cth: 65%.

in DevX 1.5.3 - armorclass 8 and cth: 101%.

that big gap & numbers wouldn't bother me if it plays identical but i tested something out with the Butcher:

rogue savegame:
single_1.zip

when you simply open the door and click the butcher dead in vanilla in most of the cases you have left over 1 big Healthpotion.

with 1.5.3 devX (armorclass: 33, cth: 112%) it's impossible to kill him using all healthpotions (one-third to ~half of the butchers health bar is left, when you die) ... from that i conclude something from the dealt damage in devX is different than in vanilla Diablo (armorclass: 19, cth: 67%)...

i did this test with all devX windows versions and the last version which i found identical to kill the butcher to vanilla is 1.3.0 (armorclass: 19, cth: 112%).

it has nothing to do with the displayed armor class, because devX 1.4.0 (armorclass: 19, cth: 112) acts exactly the same as devX 1.5.3 (armorclass: 33, cth: 112%).

this means devX 1.4.0 is the first version, where it takes much longer to kill the bastard! ;-)

i also tested if it had to do with the framefrate of the fast slaying butcher by limiting devX to 20 fps like the vanilla game, but this makes no difference. #6971

hopefully someone can bring up some light what's happening here... i really don't want to bash this great mod/port... hopefully it's only a little bug or something wrong on my side :-)

EDIT:
tested it:

in vanilla D the player gets hit ~ 11 times before the butcher falls,
in 1.3.0 the player gets hit ~ 14 times before the butcher gets down, (very comparable to vanilla D)
and with 1.5.3 the butcher hits you ~ 25 times before the player dies

[qndel]

we haven't changed any formulas

[julealgon]

@JohnnyR8 the numbers you see in vanilla 1.09 are just incorrect. The ones that DevilutionX displays are the final, correct numbers.

[JohnnyR8]

thx for your reply guys... i know... you can simple test it out with the savegame as described

[StephenCWills]

I take it back. There actually is something wrong with this save file. The following screenshots were taken from a debug session in Devilution.

---

Here is the monster array after dungeon generation. The Butcher's data is located in monster[4]. He has 50 hit, which matches up with the monster data table and Jarulf's Guide.

---

Here is what happens after we load all the monster data out of the save file. The Butcher is now located in both monster[4] and monster[11], and the latter has 25 hit. The monster at 4 is inactive so the one you're fighting is monster[11].

---

This doesn't really explain what's different between 1.3.0 and 1.4.0, but the Butcher's base hit chance in vanilla is halved. That what makes him so much easier.

One additional thing I noticed. When debugging in DevilutionX, dungeon generation places The Butcher in Monsters[11]. That might explain why he's in that location in the save file, but it doesn't really explain where the 25 hit came from.

[StephenCWills]

Ah, actually, I just thought of what could have happened. The reason The Butcher is in Monsters[11] is because objects got placed first, meaning all the Skeletons from barrels and sarcophagi would get initialized before The Butcher.

The code in loadsave.cpp claims the monster's toHit is already initialized.

https://github.com/diasurgical/devilutionX/blob/b78ec233625201a57c467e4db73ff3ce3a50637c/Source/loadsave.cpp#L681

However, it would have been initialized in InitMonster() during dungeon generation. And the monster located in Monsters[11] depends on whether you are playing a version before 1.4.0 or after. So if you take a save from 1.4.0 back into 1.3.0, you'd end up with a Butcher that has the wrong base hit chance.

[AJenbo]

Hm this would also affect someone moving back in to vanilla. I guess the conclusion is that 1.4.0 behaves correctly but you can't use a save for comparison if it has been written to by 1.4/1.5

[JohnnyR8]

thank you all for your detailed explanations - i really appreciate it... keep your dedication for this great alltime classic :-)

as additional info: the savegame was created with release 1.5.3

[StephenCWills]

I guess the conclusion is that 1.4.0 behaves correctly but you can't use a save for comparison if it has been written to by 1.4/1.5

It's a little more complicated than that. You can take a save from 1.4.0 back to vanilla, and it will work fine because vanilla reads the CTH value that 1.4.0 writes to the file. The issue here is when you take the save from 1.4.0 to 1.3.0. 1.3.0 applies the wrong CTH value to the monster and puts it back in the save file. Now both 1.3.0 and vanilla are wrong.

[AJenbo]

on the main devilutionX page on the picture is a minimap in the right corner.. how can i get this in win build?

Install 1.6.0 once it is released ... or download the test builds

[deltaoak]

on the main devilutionX page on the picture is a minimap in the right corner.. how can i get this in win build?

check the keybind for "Cycle Map Type"